[svlug] Inits (was: On the process of picking up systemd)

Rick Moen rick at svlug.org
Sat Jan 3 05:00:56 PST 2015

Ivan Sergio Borgonovo wrote:
> Are you saying that people at RH, Ubuntu, SuSE, Debian (Google??) were
> tricked into choosing a "technically inferior" solution even if they
> knew there were "superior" viable alternatives?

Wrong question - and no, I'm not a conspiracy nut.

That's far less a question than it is a speech.  It's important for you to
dismiss critics as either conspiracy nuts or obsessives over toy software
(which among other things means you've completely ignored my point about
suepvisord).  Anyway, sorry, not interested in stupid ritual debates
carefully channeled by dimissal of inconvenient facts.  But probably some
more gullible person will bite.  One typically does.

>> You would have understood this if you had taken my advice and read the
>> 'sysvinit: the eternal red herring' section of
>> http://uselessd.darknedgy.net/ProSystemdAntiSystemd/.  Please do that now,
>> before posting more non-sequitur time-wasting arguments.  Thank you.
> I did. It just seems to me that Gentoo, *BSD and Slackware weren't
> deployed at large and that the tools you've mentioned were just
> «research projects and anything [I] see as “toy projects”»

The appropriate measure of code quality, and suitabily for serious
enterprise use, is not 'Does Red Hat include it in the default
installation?'  Sorry to have to break it to you.

At your leisure, you should look through the interesting architecture of
uselessd, as he's abstracted out the components of the systemd hairball
that are actually interesting, dropping both the extreme featuritis and the
handcuffing of systems to PolKit, D-Bus,  udev, and the rest of the marching
band of mandatory tight-coupled components that is the biggest single problem
of the systemd suite.  In effect, he has extracted and made available the

It still wouldn't be my own cuppa, because I find event-driven inits to make
debugging gratuitously difficult (thus unacceptable in my view as a system
administrator), but it's a notable offering otherwise, and illustrates
through contrast what the main problem with the parent project is.

> But then you may be right, systemd was "forced" on a minority of people
> that "typically hail from more niche distributions like Slackware,
> Gentoo, CRUX and others"...

This is of course nothing at all like anything I said.  Again, you're in
search of a comspiracy nut to beat on.  Maybe you can hire Mark Bilk for hte

> For their use case systemd is "technically inferior".

Read the rest of http://uselessd.darknedgy.net/ProSystemdAntiSystemd/ -- and
lose the attitude, if it isn't epoxyed to your forehead at this point.

I'm going to ignore the rest of your long list of tendentious qustions.
Those aren't even actually questions at all, but rather speeches, and I
really have no time or interest.

More information about the svlug mailing list