[svlug] Inits (was: On the process of picking up systemd)

Ivan Sergio Borgonovo mail at webthatworks.it
Sat Jan 3 04:05:52 PST 2015

On 01/03/2015 12:41 AM, Rick Moen wrote:

> You would have understood this if you had taken my advice and read the
> 'sysvinit: the eternal red herring' section of
> http://uselessd.darknedgy.net/ProSystemdAntiSystemd/.  Please do that now,
> before posting more non-sequitur time-wasting arguments.  Thank you.

I did. It just seems to me that Gentoo, *BSD and Slackware weren't
deployed at large and that the tools you've mentioned were just
«research projects and anything [I] see as “toy projects”»

But then you may be right, systemd was "forced" on a minority of people
that "typically hail from more niche distributions like Slackware,
Gentoo, CRUX and others"...

For their use case systemd is "technically inferior".

Are you saying that people at RH, Ubuntu, SuSE, Debian (Google??) were
tricked into choosing a "technically inferior" solution even if they
knew there were "superior" viable alternatives?
Were all their users, including the one that pay their bills and
companies with large deployments, tricked to accept a "technically
inferior" solution?
Don't you think that in general companies that use Linux even if they
had enough resources to write their init system would be happier if the
most adopted init system was one that fit their needs?
Don't you think that RH (or the conspirational mansonry behind them)
would prefer to go with an init system that would make other large
contributors to the Linux stack happy?

I'd say that Slackware, Gentoo, *BSD, CRUX "use case" is technically
irrelevant and well they are free to support their use case with
whatever init they prefer as they are doing. (I'm sorry for *BSD but
well... I'm sorry for many things).

And don't get tricked by the fact that I tend to stay in group a) for
Linux system stuff (that generally I consider an appliance). When it
comes to software development I'm faced everyday with the problem of
which poison I've to take.

I do say *shit* all the time about technical choices of other developers
that substantially enable me to write my software.
"This web stuff has been written by a million monkeys." (cit.)

Isn't it frustrating when you ask people to scratch your own itch and
they keep on missing the "right" point?

We're not talking about which DE has to rule the world... seriously...
what kind of market are Linux DE contending?
We aren't talking about an unmaintained debugging tool for a niche
processor (oh shit, you #@!!@).
We aren't talking about any php[2] module for drupal as well (oh shit
shit shit and more shit).

All the stuff they placed in systemd is pretty important where Linux is
really economically relevant (embedded and cloud?).
Were all the players *seriously* involved sleeping under a rock?
I was... but even if I'm not playing in that league I'd be very
surprised if they were sleeping too.

Or simply Linux is becoming an appliance and everything will be
assimilated, all your data belongs to us.

I'd be more worried about how the cloud is getting more and more
important and having your own iron on the internet won't be economically
viable anymore and how you'll be able to have your own "private"
presence on the net in the future rather than arguing about the
conspiracy behind the incompetent people that chose systemd (mmm srly?).
But let's keep this [* and this] for another thread.

«features ostensibly meant for enterprise server management, cloud
computing, embedded systems»
So even this year is not going to be the Linux on the desktop year.
[*] oh look how many linux dev are using Apple boxes...

[2] how the hell is facebook using php? but oh wait

Ivan Sergio Borgonovo

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