[svlug] Re:XML vs. HTML

Brandon B. bonipart1 at earthlink.net
Sun Jul 8 22:47:01 PDT 2001


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> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Today's Topics:
> 
>    1. Michal Ostrowski's PPPoE page (Ivan Sergio Borgonovo)
>    2. XML vs HTML (Karl F. Larsen)
>    3. Re: XML vs HTML (Karsten M. Self)
>    4. Re: Michal Ostrowski's PPPoE page (Dan Martinez)
>    5. Re: XML vs HTML (Bill Jonas)
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Subject:
> 
> [svlug] Michal Ostrowski's PPPoE page
> From:
> 
> Ivan Sergio Borgonovo <mail at gorilla.it>
> Date:
> 
> Sun, 8 Jul 2001 14:35:17 +0200
> To:
> 
> svlug at svlug.org
> 
> 
> Does anyone know where I could find any help/further info about PPPoE 
> support in kernel 2.4?
> http://www.shoshin.uwaterloo.ca/~mostrows/ seems unreachable.
> 
> I've found http://www.adsl4linux.de; it has a lot of setup examples 
> but I don't know german and RTFS is currently too much effort for me.
> 
> It seems that just copying will work but I would like to understand a 
> bit of what I'm doing.
> Furthermore PPPoE support doesn't seem to need any patch in kernel 
> 2.4.4+ and it has been stablily integrated in the main kernel source.
> 
> SuSE help is related to 2.2 kernels + a nano howto for kernel 2.3.
> Unless I missed it there is no doc included in kernel 2.4.6 
> documentation.
> 
> TIA
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Subject:
> 
> [svlug] XML vs HTML
> From:
> 
> "Karl F. Larsen" <k5di at zianet.com>
> Date:
> 
> Sun, 8 Jul 2001 10:04:20 -0600 (MDT)
> To:
> 
> <svlug at svlug.org>
> 
> 
> 	I have been reading about a new file markup system called XML.
> There are books out on the language that are not real expensive.
> 
> 	HTML is a good language that was easy to learn and I have several
> web pages written with HTML.
> 
> 	My question to you is, as web designers, have you found a good
> reason to switch from HTML to XML? What are the reasons?
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Subject:
> 
> Re: [svlug] XML vs HTML
> From:
> 
> "Karsten M. Self" <kmself at ix.netcom.com>
> Date:
> 
> Sun, 8 Jul 2001 10:32:43 -0700
> To:
> 
> svlug at svlug.org
> 
> 
> on Sun, Jul 08, 2001 at 10:04:20AM -0600, Karl F. Larsen (k5di at zianet.com) wrote:
> 
>> 	I have been reading about a new file markup system called XML.
>> There are books out on the language that are not real expensive.
>> 
>> 	HTML is a good language that was easy to learn and I have several
>> web pages written with HTML.
>> 
>> 	My question to you is, as web designers, have you found a good
>> reason to switch from HTML to XML? What are the reasons?
> 
> 
> XML is a markup language specification standard.  It's not a markup
> language of itself.  Think of it as a meta-markup language.
> Instanciations include some SGML datatypes, however, the salient
> characteristic of XML is that it is, well, extensible.
> 
> The problem with XML is that, because it is extensible, there's not much
> direct use of it as such, and there are concerns that it may be possible
> (despite design intent and specifications to the contrary) to use XML to
> produce yet another generation of bloated, obfuscated, document formats.
> 
> Interesting stuff, but hard to get clear guidance on.
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Subject:
> 
> Re: [svlug] Michal Ostrowski's PPPoE page
> From:
> 
> Dan Martinez <dfm at area.com>
> Date:
> 
> Sun, 8 Jul 2001 10:52:13 -0700
> To:
> 
> svlug at svlug.org
> 
> 
> Ivan wrote:
> 
>> Does anyone know where I could find any help/further info about PPPoE 
>> support in kernel 2.4?
>> http://www.shoshin.uwaterloo.ca/~mostrows/ seems unreachable.
> 
> 
> All Praise Google and the Expanse of its Cache:
> 
> http://www.google.com/search?q=cache:w7O02O5kkLc:www.math.uwaterloo.ca/~mostrows/+pppoe+mostrows&hl=en&lr=lang_en|lang_de|lang_es
> 
> 
>> I've found http://www.adsl4linux.de; it has a lot of setup examples 
>> but I don't know german and RTFS is currently too much effort for me.
> 
> 
> You could try the BabelFish. Its translation may not be perfect, but
> it's better than nothing. Visit:
> 
>     http://world.altavista.com
> 
> and then sic it on http://www.adsl4linux.de.
> 
> (Being blissfully PPPoE-free, I have no specific advice to offer.)
> 
> Dan
> 
> 
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> 
> Subject:
> 
> Re: [svlug] XML vs HTML
> From:
> 
> Bill Jonas <bill at billjonas.com>
> Date:
> 
> Sun, 8 Jul 2001 14:09:54 -0400
> To:
> 
> svlug at svlug.org
> 
> 
> On Sun, Jul 08, 2001 at 10:04:20AM -0600, Karl F. Larsen wrote:
> 
>> 	My question to you is, as web designers, have you found a good
>> reason to switch from HTML to XML? What are the reasons?
> 
> 
> The utility of XML is more for data exchange than for marking up web
> pages.  In fact, until there is something like a mod_xml, or some sort
> of XML -> HTML "compiler", or if you're using if to store data for CGI
> programs to translate, its utility will be rather limited in web design
> since there are no web browsers (to my knowledge) that support XML
> directly.
> 
> OTOH, the comments above are not intended to apply to SOAP, which is a
> sort-of RPC via XML over HTTP... but in any case, you wouldn't really
> write web pages in XML.
> 
> 
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> 
i think of it this way. html is used to display data and xml is to 
present data. so with that taken...xml will never replace html as a 
whole but if you choose to use it may complementory. then comes xhtml (i 
dont really see the purpose of this so if you have a good explanation of 
it please send my way) i believe its just a proper version of html. 
meaning that instead of ignoring to use a closing tag to end a paragraph 
_</p>...you must close the statement--so what i take from xhtml is that 
its meaning is to simply create a standard for writting the code.
yours truly
brandon b

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