[svlug] Logo port for Linux

[Ray Olszewski]

At 10:21 AM 11/6/98 -0800, Rafael Skodlar wrote:
>On Fri, 6 Nov 1998, Seth David Schoen wrote:
[deleted]
>> I think the comp.lang.logo FAQ also has a list of implementations, but UCB
>> Logo may be your best bet for free software for Linux.
>
>That all looks nice but the reality is:
>
>http://www.netschools.net/solution.htm
>
>Guess what's going to happen to fresh minds under development.

No, the reality is competition for the education market, not any one
product. General K12 education -- as distinct from specialties like computer
science -- desperately needs products worth using. There are now few
available, whatever the OS choice.

I took a look at this site and it looks like just one more company pitching
one more product. Why should we act or sound defeated just because there is
competition from the Microsoft camp here?

Yes, the server component is NT based, but what do you expect from
run-of-the-mill software developers? This just means that Linux-based (and
other open-source based) solutions will need to show why they are better.
That's how competition works; surely by now we're past the point of saying
that the mere existence of an NT-based product is a problem. Especially
based on a presentation that (as far as I could find) includes no
information about startup or ongoing costs.

In fact, for the most part, the system they sell looks like a good try,
given the current state of technology. Were I retooling it, I'd use
Linux-based servers (of course); worry about the weight (7+ lb) of the
laptops they expect students to haul around day-in, day-out; wonder about
battery life (or the logistics of providing an outlet per kid in classrooms)
and how they fit W95, Works, and any user files in a mere 40 megs of
("solid-state") mass storage; want to know the details of how the IR-port
networking works in classroom settings; wonder how they handle (or expect
schools to handle) lost/stolen/damanged equipment in a setting where they
expect the kids to take computers home; and want to think more about the
curriculum-development component of the system. And, of course, I'd want to
know what this all costs.

While I could make a case for Linux-based laptops too, it's not as solid as
the case any of us can make for Linux servers. Among the negatives: X11 on
small screens is a pain and a lot of apps are available only in Win9x
versions. I also think (from having taught computer applications, computer
programming, math, and writing in the K-8 school where I was once a network
manager) that highly-interated products like MS Works (which this system
uses) or ClarisWorks really are easier to use in a classroom setting then
the more powerful but less integrated Office suites available for either OS. 

Positives for Linux laptops are a better system for updating via the network
and (remember, this is a school market) incompatibility with most commercial
games. The balance here is tricky; I suspect W95 wins for the moment simply
because it is more familiar to non-techie users. 

Actually, I suspect the pre-college education market will eventually prove
to be a good one for Linux in general, because it is so price sensitive.
Yes, the Linux community has to address issues like ease of setup, and it
has to become easier for customers nationwide to find competitively priced,
pre-configured systems. But that's all stuff that people are already working
on. 

But, mainly, we need good Linux-based applications for this market --
something that a linux-based Logo can contribute to (but not be the complete
answer for). This is in part a technical problem, but in greater part it is
a matter of understanding the learning process well enough to design
applications that improve learning enough to be worth the cost -- still a
weakness in the products available for ANY OS.

So in the end, I am encouraged by the exploration of Logo on Linux, and I'd
see this whole topic as an opportunity for us to think productively about
what a Linux-centered system needs to make a real contribution to primary
and secondary education.

------------------------------------"Never tell me the odds!"---
Ray Olszewski                                        -- Han Solo
762 Garland Drive
Palo Alto, CA  94303-3603
650.321.3561 voice                               ray at comarre.com
650.322.1209 fax                 http://www.comarre.com/ray.html
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